And Mary bore Jesus Christ our Saviour for to be,With best wishes to my friends in the blogosphere,
And the first tree in the greenwood, it was the holly.
Chookie
And Mary bore Jesus Christ our Saviour for to be,With best wishes to my friends in the blogosphere,
And the first tree in the greenwood, it was the holly.
11 comments:
Merry Christmas to you and yours. Thanks for the carol, it's beautiful!
Merry Christmas to you and your family.
Lovely carol.
thank you thank you thank you!
Hi chookie. last night over at Rhond Jean's blog I didnt know how to respond to silly Simone from Brisbane's comments about Michael Leunig so I just left it....and there this morning was your gorgeous comment summing it all up beautifully. Thank you Chookie and now I have discovered your beautiful thoughtfull blog.
Merry Christmas!
Duckie.
Duck Herder-
Ad hominem attacks (e.g 'silly' Simone) are the last resort of those who have already lost the argument and should be ignored. Next time I suggest you play the ball, not the man.
Chookie -
'If we deny the humanity of our enemies, we become inhuman ourselves.'
How interesting.
Unlike Leunig, I look upon Osama bin Laden (and his followers) as monsters in human form. Unlike Leunig, my compassion (especially at Xmas time) is reserved for the victims of bin Laden's murderous deeds, and the victims' long-suffering families. If that makes me inhuman in your book, then it's a badge I wear with pride and dignity.
Simone (Brisbane)
Simone (Brisbane) Bin laden and his followers are all too human and you are displaying the same inflexible intolerant mindset that they do.
Cheers Chookie. Hope your Christmas was all you hoped and the carol was indeed lovely. Hope the new year is better and brighter than the old.
Jane, this comes from the Talmud and, contrary to your baseless accusations, perfectly explains my mindset on this matter:
Those who are kind to the cruel, in the end will be cruel to the kind.
Wouldn't you agree that Leunig's words about bin Laden (that I posted on Rhonda's 'Down to Earth' blog) would give comfort to terrorists whilst causing untold pain to his victims? And that sits well with you? It doesn't with me.
By the way, that you would seek to equate my mindset (you don't even know me) with people who torture and kill tens of thousands of innocents in cold blood is more indicting of you and your mindset than anything that I have written is about me.
Simone (Brisbane)
Simone, I am not sure how it is hurtful to consider that a mass murderer might have some virtues. If OBL loves his grandchildren, that doesn't make him less of a mass murderer. But OBL is only a murderer because he first divides people into Us and Them, the righteous and the infidels. How is your heart any different?
To put this in the context of my own beliefs: "Everyone has sinned. No one measures up to God's glory. The free gift of God's grace makes all of us right with him. Christ Jesus paid the price to set us free," (Romans 3:23-24) and, "Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be sons of your Father in heaven" (Matthew 5:44).
Chookie-
I do admire your remarkable ability to see inside my heart. Not even my beloved husband can do that! My faith teaches me to assess myself and others by ACTIONS, not by what may or may not be in our respective hearts (only God - not you and not Jane -can know the contents of another person’s heart).
So when it comes to murder (the most reprehensible action I can think of) my heart is entirely preoccupied with the terror and loss experienced by the murdered and the endless pain of those who loved them. I therefore find incomprehensible the compassion for murderers, as expressed, for example, by Michael Leunig in his 2001 Christmas message. His call for us to look upon OBL as part of our family is, in my opinion, completely immoral. It is an insult to the murdered and a horrible slap in the face to their families and loved ones. People like OBL should simply be captured, put on military trial and given the death penalty. Nothing more, nothing less.
After all, history shows that the kind of pacifistic thinking espoused by Leunig does absolutely nothing to minimise acts of terror/genocide. If Leunig’s ideology had dictated the response to Hitler in WWII we would have had lots of self-righteous people throughout the world sitting around their Xmas tables, tucking into turkey and picturing Uncle Adolf in the vacant chair while the entire German population of Jews, gypsies, homosexuals and disabled were sent to the slaughter. Thank God history gave us the allied armed forces instead.
As it happens, I believe it is possible that you and I both have good hearts but, perhaps, different minds and different value systems. I seem to disagree with you on this issue, but I do so without ascribing to your heart or your mindset any unfavourable or distasteful qualities. Nor would I presume to label you as inhumane simply because we don’t see eye to eye. It’s a shame that you (and some of your readers) couldn’t extend me the same courtesy.
Thank you for allowing me to bloviate on your blog! I will read any further postings with interest, but will not comment further as I have said all I need/want to say on the issue.
Happy New Year to you.
Simone (Brisbane)
Belated Christmas greetings, Chookie. Hope it was merry and bright (and warm, sigh!) and all the best in the new year.
I wonder, Simone, if you have been offended because you are assuming that I do not think that OBL should be brought to justice or resisted. Not so; I believe that he and all other criminals should be tried under relevant laws.
But when I acknowledge OBL as family, I must acknowledge how easy it is to become someone like him -- and as I said, it starts by dehumanising the Other. The Americans have recently shown how short a step it is from civilised behaviour to Abu Ghraib and 'renditions' -- and it's not much further to Auschwitz.
Unfortunately, I must agree that you have been bloviating here rather than discussing. Pity.
Wishing you a peaceful New Year, Chookie.
Simone, as you don't know anything about me, you're being rather presumptuous about my beliefs.
Bin Laden and his fanatical followers are very human in all they do, just like gay-bashers, abortion clinic bombers, Nazis, Stalin, Mao Tse Tung, David Koresh, Jim Jones, Robespierre and a host of other zealots.
They all have the same mindset, though; a complete lack of respect for anyone else's view point or beliefs, an absolute conviction that their way is the only way and a pathological inability to tolerate dissent.
Unfortunately, these characteristics are as much a part of the human personality as tolerance, kindness or respect for others' beliefs.
I believe bin Laden is a bad person and his followers are misguided fanatics, but they are all too human, despite their appalling behaviour.
Post a Comment